Chassis reinforcements
 

Hi all, I'm a noob to miatas but very experienced with cars in general. I'm considering selling my skyline and getting a miata to make a track car / weekend car. I see a lot of people make chassis reinforcements to make them even more rigid. Anybody know if they are worth it? Do they add too much weight? Also any advice when looking for a miata?

Sure, for our right speed with similar mods (but a lot more expensive) the NC is faster than the NB and the NA. The NB is probably the better platform of the NA/NB (the same chassis), as Mazda addressed some of the issues present with the NAs chassis.

I track an NB, mostly I love the bang for the buck we get. maintenance is lower and the car is cheaper than practically any other car you can think of.

Chassis rigidity is questionable. Some of it is worth it and some of it isn't. I have had some discussions on this before, but it has been sometime. The aim is to reduce the chassis flex/play due to not having a roof, with that said the best way to do that is by adding bracing as high as you can get it...and connecting the "rear" and "front" chassis. Since our tub is shaped like a U for the most part, you are looking to seal the top of the U pretty much.

Since we lack anything like that other than cage bar doors, anything other than roll bars (which are safety more than rigidity), is usually not very effective. Ultimately you want something to strengthen our torsional rigidity, so cowl shakes and bump unsettling are not the best ways to measure that, which is what most people mention the improvements in.

Frame rails are good if your rails are damaged. I have heard good stuff about the frog arms or whatever (the things that go in the front fender), but I have never tried them. I used to have the boss frog door bars and they did work great, but they came up short (literally and figuratively). Ultimately, you want your door bars to end connected to the rockers or firewall (preferrably the rockers), not the floor pan which is a ------- joke anyway.

tl;dr:
Roll bars are worth it, but more so for safety. caging is worth it. a modified/welded in door bar is worth it. the rest is use at your own discretion.

Thanks, I personally dont find the NC as nice looking as the NA or NB so I will be looking for one of the NA/NB style. i've seen the frog arms online and I guess it does make since to stiffen that portion of the chassis. Most of the reinforcements I would fabricate myself since I have the means to do this. Except the roll bar which will be one of the first mods I purchase because I want it to look and fit perfect. I guess the real question is do they need it? I've never driven a miata but have always heard how well they can handle. I dont want to go throwing extra weight and money at a car that it does not need.

My personal and uneducated opinion on chassis rigidty would say if you want to "fix" our chassis, just cage the car, or go for a half-cage with door bars (proper door bars).

if i was looking to stiffen the chassis, i would go with the boss frog arms, Flyin miata butterfly brace, and a hard dog double diagonal roll bar, sway bars and a good suspension. :sign0134:
edit: i forgot to add door bars.

Thats pretty close to what I was thinking. I would probably start with a butterfly brace and door bars but fabricate them myself, and then buy a roll bar. I would like to hear some feedback from people who have used the frog bars. It makes sense to me from the physics aspect how they could work, but real life experience trumps my physics every time. I really dont want to go adding too much weight to the car if it does pay off in the end.

I see you are from ohio, I'm originally from newark ,OH. That may be where I get a miata from too. I still have family there that could pick one up for me.

if you going to do it yourself make it out of the heavyiest gauge sheet metal possible.

I would get the Hard Dog Hard Core roll bar from Bethania Garage with either the single or double diagonals. I would also buy their door bar kit that is made to work with and tie to the lower front mounts on the rollbar so that it is all tied together. This will make more difference than the butterfly brace. I have heard many times that these door bars are great for chassis rigidity when tied in this way.

I don't know if there is much gain in the frog arms but they aren't terribly expensive or difficult to install.

Just make sure that your Miata has all of the (in some cases optional) factory subframe bracing. If yours isn't equipped with them, you should get them because they do work.

I will probably make everything out of tubing since I have more exp. with it.

Will do. Thanks for all the tips I'll be sure to check for the subframe bracing. As for the door bars I will probably make them myself. I would like to make them connect to the roll bar (hard dog with the double diagonals is my favorite) at least two places on the subframe/rockers and the firewall to link to the strut tower braces.

Of course the biggest problem right now is I need to buy a Miata. I have found a 94' and a 97' locally but I need to sell my skyline before I can register another car in my name, but right now it's too cold :ohnoes: to go out and clean it up to get it ready for sale.

I lived in Augsburg for zwei jahre.

How did you like it? I'm here accompanied so I have another 14 months (36 total) Gotta say I'm gonna miss it when I go. Autobahns everywhere and I'm less than an hour from the Nurburgring :D

I took all of the MWR weekend tour bus trips I could to different countries and cities. I tried to see everything. And I ventured on my own quite a bit too.

By contrast, my sister in law and their family went and I don't think they left the base. What a waste.

Such a waste, I haven't been out as much as I would like. But I've still seen a lot of Germany and a little of Belgium and Luxembourg. I am planning on a few weekend trips to Paris and the coast of Portugal (maybe a long weekend) this summer and maybe Ireland If I can get a tour at Guinness breweries. oh yeah and a weekend down around the "eagles nest" and visit the cafe there. I just think it would be funny to say "I went to Hitlers house for lunch" And of course hit Austria and Switzerland while I'm in the area. I also want to see Dachau, I hear it is a very sobering experience.

Dammit, hearing that makes me really sad I pissed out on a chance at a 3 year assignment in Stuttgart. Take advantage and live it up! Otherwise, you will be bitter like myself.

You can't be bitter with Adam Jr. now!

He is sure to bring more happiness (and headache/bitterness) than any trip to Stuttgart.

That is true track! BTW, he's named after his grandfather Alvin. Mommy didn't like Adam Jr. :)

Oh, I intend on it.

Southern Germany on the edges of the Alps and on into the Alps themselves in Austria are awesome. Go to the castles, see everything you can.

Go to the smaller fests that run all spring and summer in all of the medium and smaller towns. They are all great. I suddenly crave ein mass helles and an oom-pah band like you wouldn't believe. My wife doesn't get it.

My favorite festival is wine fest in an local town called Bernkastel. Probably the coolest place I've ever been.

I found a few pics of bernkastel I think you might enjoy.
In the first pic, the little pizzaria on the right is hands down the best food I have ever had anywhere. And a lot of the houses in this part of town date back to the 1400's Most are still being used as little cafes and such. The whole town is down in a valley along the mosel river and surrounded by vineyards and has the ruins of a castle overlooking it.

https://www.miataforumz.com/attachme...ine=1328821358

https://www.miataforumz.com/attachme...ine=1328821358

https://www.miataforumz.com/attachme...ine=1328821358

https://www.miataforumz.com/attachme...ine=1328821358

https://www.miataforumz.com/attachme...ine=1328821358

https://www.miataforumz.com/attachme...ine=1328821358

wow, that's beautiful. My ancestors left all this for the Midwest of the US? Sheesh, food and money aren't everything.

Land was much cheaper in the US and there was pretty extreme poverty in many of the countries that are now prosperous. Not to mention the system of government was quite oppressive to any that tried to get ahead. I'm sure they didn't enter into it lightly. Nice to visit but the cyclical nature of governments makes good places bad and bad places good throughout history.

But it is beautiful and I would love to spend more time there.

A 3 Point bar is good to stiffen up the chassis. I went from a normal 2 point to 3 and the handling of the car has much improved.

just bought a Carbing rear strut bar. i'll take pictures of it when it gets here